Talk about whatever you want to here, but stay correct
#143227 by VoiceInTheFan
Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:06 am
Hello Everybody! I'm Corey Lombardo, a junior in college (Bloomsburg University in PA) taking a Linguistics course and I have decided to base my research project (55% of my grade) on the study of vocal style variations in metal. My main point is that in most North American versions of metal, vocal style and lyrical content doesn't necessarily go hand-in-hand with the subgenre like in most European ones. Most American and Canadian metal bands choose a midrangy scream style and clean singing.

Now if ya'll wouldn't mind, I could use your help. As obvious fans of metal and musicians, if you'd like to help, just answer in a post to any or all of these questions:

Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?


Go into any detail you want and please go ahead and provide recommendations for listening or examples.Be candid or funny, I just want any comments you'd like to give at all. If you are a musician, please go into your own vocal styles and I'm looking for variation so for example, in the lyrics question, give me your personal opinion and not what the classic answer should be. I will also accept some tasteful discussion if there are differences in opinion.

THANKS A LOT GUYS!!

Disclaimer: If you don't feel like participating, you can very easily bypass this. This is very assuredly a purely academic pursuit and I appreciate ALL input!!

This is something everyone who listens to metal has to approach and I feel it is a relevant question. Thanks again to all who reply. I will be on everyday to check!!

Edit: OOOO Sorry and if you wouldn't mind posting what region in the world you are from, that would rock!!!

#143240 by Deth Warmdover
Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:08 am
I wish there was more women vocalists in heavy metal, particularly extreme metal. Non commercial metal is still mostly a boys club vocally.Woman still seem to rely on expected norms of vocal styles and don't seem to experement with their vocals as much as men.As mainstream rock embraces girl lead bands, it seems metals response is more testostorone, less women. Even GWAR lost Slymenstra.
I like Devys vocals for alot of reasons, but one thing in particular is he sings with his Canadian accent. Very rare in Canadian metal where most vocalists ape popular styles and accents.

#143256 by Grimview
Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:15 pm
First off; I'm from Canada.

I, personally, prefer different vocal styles for different lyrical themes. If it's angry and violent, shouted or screamed (like Devy in Strapping Young Lad) or snarled (think early Megadeth Dave Mustaine, and most of Denis "Snake" Belanger's career in Voivod) vocals suit the mood and music best. They also tend to be the easiest to sing along to, which generally suits live performance of these songs, as if the crowd can shout along, it increases participation and enjoyment of both the band and the fans.

Clean vocals, in my opinion, are best matched with more sensitive lyrics, or over less aggressive riffs. A good example would be in Random Analysis by Devin; while the tone, and the riffs themselves, carry some heaviness, they don't really convey aggression... it's something different in the music. And it makes Devin's clean vocals during the song stick out quite well. Slower songs, mellower songs, and even fast songs that aren't meant to be angry, protestful or aggressive are generally best vocalised via clean or operatic vocals as well.
While I think this should be obvious, I believe that the only vocals to go over acoustic playing should be clean vocals. :P

All in all, it really depends on the music and the lyrical content. For the most part, I believe more introverted, "softer" emotional lyrics should be sung clean (Devin Townsend on "Storm," Bruce Dickinson on "Journeyman" and "Out of the Shadows," Rob Halford on "Angel," and Glenn Danzig on "Blood and Tears," are all good examples), whereas more aggressive lyrics can be sung, shouted, or screamed - it's really the singer's preference there.

As an aside; I hate all these "screamo" bands that think taking a punk guitar riff, an emo (the music, not just generally emotional) lyric, and a screaming vocalist make them a heavy band. It really doesn't. Screaming does not suit that form of music. Hell, the so-called "singing" the bands with "clean-singing" vocalists use generally isn't really singing; it's a style of high-pitched whining, to my ears. I just don't see any merit in the majority of that genre, lyrically, vocally, or musically.
Just felt like I'd throw in an example of vocal styles that are bad. :P

Note: While I suppose snarling is more clean than it is harsh, vocal-wise, it's really a middle-ground for people who don't want to scream, but don't want to out and out sing.

Edit- To be more specific, on my region; British Columbia, Canada.
Last edited by Grimview on Fri Mar 16, 2007 6:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

#143261 by VoiceInTheFan
Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:59 pm
Cool, thanks alot! I've had a tough time getting responses on other sites, so thanks!!

#143263 by Noodles
Fri Mar 16, 2007 6:02 pm
"Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal."

I like them if they're done well and sound like the vocalists natural way of conveying emotion and suits the music - Converge, Buried Inside, Neurosis (Souls At Zero--->Times of Grace era), Burzum, Ulver (Bergtatt/Nattens Madrigal), Dark Tranquillity, The Project Hate, Soilwork's first two albums, Exhumed, Death. I generally dislike them if they sound like the vocals were just used as an afterthought to the music, which I find is often the case in death metal and a lot of thrash metal.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

I dislike them most of the time because it tends to come across as cheesy, and the vocals put far too much emphasis on making the chorus of a song memorable/catchy. Also, unless the vocalist is very good at writing melodies, the music generally has to be simple for clean vocals being sung over top of them, and simple backing music pretty much instantly bores me. There are clean vocalists that prove the exception to this and I think they are the ones that make the best music - The Postman Syndrome, Tool, Devy, Protest the Hero.

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

Basically whatever the singer feels like singing about, the only time I've thought lyrics didn't suit an albums music/singing is Buried Inside's Chronoclast, which proved that a concept album about the measurement of time doesn't suit epicly violent music.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?

Not really, I think that any vocal style can sound great if the singer does it well.



I also agree that metal eneds more women singers, but also metal bands that have female vocals need to stop having such boring backing music =(

(I'm from western canada)

#143275 by Dissentient
Fri Mar 16, 2007 10:08 pm
"Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal."

I really like black metal vocals, death metal vocals...death metal for the grimness, black metal for the atmosphere...best vocals for black metal:Blakkheim (diabolical masquerade) or Valfar (Windir)

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

I generally dont like operatic vocals cause i think it is too cheezy. clean vocals can be good depending how they are used...i only like a couple of clean singers. there is devin who is the best...ihsahn (emperor) Jonas Renske (Katatonia) Peter Steele (Type O Negative)


What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

the lyrical theme is not important...what matters is wether the lyrics themselves are important to the song.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?

In my band i use death and black metal vocals. Ive been working on my clean but not happy with them yet.

#143297 by VoiceInTheFan
Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:44 am
Cool, I'm really happy with the responses I've been getting now. It's awesome!!
#143321 by djskrimp
Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:35 pm
VoiceInTheFan wrote:
Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.

'Distorted' by means of vocal chord, throat, mouth and lung manipulation: I tend to like it for the dynamic it brings to the music, and for the aggression it so obviously represents. It is said that man at his baser nature is no less a feral and animalistic than any other wild creature. What better way to present that than through tortured vocals? However, there is a degree in which it becomes nothing more than a technique unto itself only...see lesser talented "mallcore" bands and bad death metal bands. At this point, there are many fine barkers, howlers, groaners and screamers. The voice is as much a part of the art as the music, and it is readily apparent. It's the ones trying to punch the clock and collect the meal ticket that turn me off.
'Distorted' by means of electronic manipulation: Has its place, as well. Sometimes, the best way to convey the feeling of emotionlessness or isolation or despair is by using digital distortion. Also, when the mood is set by the song or the theme calls for it, using a gimmick to give the voice an otherworldy sound fits. Too much use grates on my nerves, and sounds like a crutch, to me. But, used sparingly and with an ear towards art, it can add colour that can't be obtained by other means.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

I can appreciate the talent and effort in a well-sung, clean passage. I would never begrudge Christina Aguilera her obvious talents, and even think she sounds as powerful as mountains. But, most of her songs are unlistenable because of their nature...to sell records. same with Mariah Carey. To carry over to metal, I will say the same for Roy Khan of Kamelot. Excellent range, perfect pitch and precise control. Yet, he adds one more element that brings me into the songs to stay: He sings of things to speak to me, personally. So, technique and training and virtousity can exist in art, as long as it is all brought to bare within the piece, and not to showcase the talent. You can have a million dollar camera, and all the equipment, and all the lighting, but if the picture you take doesn't say anything, then what good is it? You can take a picture that speaks volumes about what the photographer feels and aspires to, even from a simple point-and-shoot, so, too, can you convey the feeling and emotion of a song with adequate vocals. If a person chooses to take the time to learn technique and practices to achieve a higher level of performance, and the end result is still to create meaningful (to the artist, at least) songs...then it will most likely capture my ear, heart and mind. In the context of metal: Why not? Metal gets derided for being "dumb", yet what other genre of music has included SO MUCH and still retained it's integrity and core? None. Metal is, well, metal. The skeletal framework is sturdy and solid...so, what other music could you plausibly overlay such disparate textures and still convey clearly ideas and feelings?

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

Any that are hearfelt and competently carried out. Look at Voivod...from gritty thrash to space metal to a mechanized sort of juggernaut. That's in a single band...metal has the ability to conform to any idea or theme. It's the carrying out that trips a lot of bands up.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?


No, because to have one over another would be to deny what fits. When Dev sings cleanly, beautifully on "Let It Roll", it fits. Its old time, open country feel is best served by the vocal delivery that Dev choose to use. On "Pixillate", he chooses a much gruffer vocal delivery, and has the beautiful dynamic of female vocals, sung cleanly, as a counerpoint to his. (He pulled off both styles perfectly live, btw). As a matter of fact, I would venture to say that the reason Dev has moved up into my favorite perfomer/songwriter the last 10 years is not because he has SOOO many vocal styles, (The most I've ever heard, and he keeps coming up with new ones each album...son of bitch), but that he never lets the style override the theme or idea or emotion of the SONG. Sure, there are some singers who keep one style and pull it off quite well. But, to have such a wide palate of sounds to choose from, and be smart enough and true enough to the art as to use it exactly as needed....there's a damned good reason people refer to Dev as "genius". In my mind, he personifies artistic integrity.



Edit: OOOO Sorry and if you wouldn't mind posting what region in the world you are from, that would rock!!!

I am a US Army brat....I have no place I call "home". I was born in Oklahoma, USA and raised in Germany. I have been in the US military for well over 10 years, and have continued the trend of constantly moving. I am of the world, but currently reside in Japan. Does this answer your question?


#143331 by danceswithchickens
Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:43 am
I've always loved a good growl. It instantly brings a higher level of heaviness to the music; just about any kind of metal becomes death metal when you put those kind of vocals to it. problem is that it's overdone, so a lot of it ends up sounding the same. But certain vocalist have styles that stand out; Fernando from Moonspell, Chuck from Testament, the guy form Gojira, Glen from Deicide, etc.

I hate black metal vocals. That kind of screeching just drives me nuts. I can't even imagine what there is to like about it.

I like a good scream, though. I think Phil Anselmo mastered the art of the modern metal scream on "Far Beyond Driven" and "The Great Southern Trendkill". Devin also has one of the best, of course. Again, it has become overdone, especially during the brief reign of nu-metal; Fred Durst did a lot to ruin the metal scream, if you ask me.

I don't have much use for "operatic" vocals, except if they are used sparingly and in context, as Devin sometimes does. But as a primary vocal style, as in power metal, the cheese factor is simply way too high for my liking. I have no problem with well-implemented clean vocals, though. However, they are now being used in a very formulaic sense in the 'metalcore' movement; harsh verse, clean chorus, harsh verse, and so on. It's like a formula to make your music credible with the metal community, while at the same time commercially viable. it can be done well and convincingly, but it can also come across as a commercial cop-out.

As for lyrics; I don't put as much importance on lyrics as some people do. As long as they aren't so terrible that they take away from the music, they are good enough for me. If they are so good that they make you think and try to read into them, I consider it a bonus.

Overall, I'd say that I generally prefer harsh vocals to clean. I guess they are just more satisfying in much of the music I listen to. Those who don't like metal will never understand why we like to listen to someone yell and scream and growl; I mean, even by this basic description, it hardly sounds like an interesting form of music. But take a band like Pantera, and imagine them without any harsh vocals at all. it simply doens't work, does it?

#143335 by Goat
Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:43 am
Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.

For me, the aggressive vocals must HAVE balls, NOT trying to convince me they have balls. I can feel it on my own, I don't need to be convinced. What I mean is, when listening to an album, I know if the vocal approach is there because the singer feels it ( :roll:) or because he thinks that is the best style to use for certain effect.
These types of vocals serve a purpose. It's extremely unnatural to sing this way because it distorts the lyrical message. But! There is message in the form itself. It's in the listener's face to deal with.
For me also this type of vocs demand a self-referential turn of the performer: the form he's using serves entertainment purposes, so if he would like me to take him dead serious, he's delusional. But when this specific form touches me in some way, speaks to me, if I do take it dead serious, then I the listener am the one who has to perform the self-referential turn! No cults, if you know what I mean.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

I'm a sing-along nerd. I like high pitched catchy melodies. I sing along to King Diamond! This type of vocals demands more compositional approach. In growls there is little variations in pitch, with clean vocals pitch is essential (even when it sits on one note, it carries a different message than with growls). Vocals are the instrument, but carrying two types of emotion: lyrical and musical. When both support each other, you get top notch vocals, namely Devin (example: Deadhead).

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

If presented sincerely, I buy all themes. There's no particular theme more suitable for one style over the other. I could listen to Cannibal Corpse lounge style all day and piss my pants. It's entertainment. If Glen Benton would sing about changing his kid's dipers, lawnmoving the backyard and watching info channel in the afternoon, I'd do the same.

You might also find this topic interesting:
http://hevydevyforums.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5931

On SYL boards we also had tons of discussion on specifically Devin's approach to extreme metal. Some of his philosophy can be found on the Strapping's For Those Aboot to Rock DVD.

P.S. It would be great if you presented some of your thoughts so we can open a debate. Opinions are opinions, what you want is an academic discussion. Let's have it.

Oh, I'm from Slovenia, that would be south east-to-central Europe, former Yugoslavia, east of northern Italy, south of Austria. :D

#143338 by VoiceInTheFan
Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:27 am
Fair enough, cool

Distorted Vocals: I have a tough time getting into every new band I listen to because the growls and the screams are all a lot different. Once I get over it, it is very rewarding. I'd be far worse far without Opeth and SYL in my life. I dislike them when they sound really weak. I admittedly laughed at the first song off the first Chimaira EP when the vocals came in,but I got a little more used to it. But that's why Devy's simply the best. His distorted vox don't sound like someone took his lunch money, but like his whole being is coming out of his mouth.

Clean vocals: Of course, being a musician myself, I'm all about melody. All of my favorite vocalists are my favorites because of the way they sing clean. If Mikael Akerfeldt didn't sing every once in a while, Opeth would be very good still, but it would be missing something essential to their genius.

The only thing is that I think women are a little too pigeonholed here. I feel women can put less effort into singing clean and can probably sing in a distorted style more easily.

Lyrical themes: I know classically that the vocal styles accompanied the creation of new subgenres in metal, particularly black and death. But a lot of newer bands really changed that. You can sing and play in a death metal style without singing about dragging corpses around and fucking them with chainsaws!! Bands I like that do that are Between the Buried and Me and Amon Amarth.

Fave vocal style: The main reason Dev is my favorite modern musician is because of his working in extremes. Intense musical moments need wild screams and soft moments need croons and operatic wails. As long as you match the moment with the right amount of variation, you rock... and that's something I have trouble with in my own music.

And I'm from a tiny town in rural Pennsylvania in the US called...ehem... Hetlerville... (HORSE APPLES)... Thanks for everyone's input so far!!!

#143342 by Zyprexa
Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:04 pm
Right sir! I'm from Corcaigh (or Cork, in English) in Eire (or Ireland).
Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.
I am a big black metal fan (in that I largely enjoy black metal, not that I am big and like black metal). I enjoy listening to heavy vocals and screams in music; they add impact and create atmosphere. However, I find that often in black metal the musical aspect can be overlooked, creating a dry and moreover, a tuneless feel.
Growls - These have to be in context, not just randomly placed in a song if there's singing. And it's as much about the lyrics as it is about how the growls sound.
Screams - Yes, give me plenty of these. Beginning a verse with a well-toned scream can be very nice indeed. Especially if it's a natural scream! Not altered with synthesis and that jazz. Screaming along can be quite theraputic.
Grunts - Pigs grunt. Metallers don't. 'Nuff sed.
Vox in General - Like I said, it's as much about the lyrics as it is about the sound generated, but the sound is quite important indeed. It helps you attain a taste for what you're about to hear. 'Forces of Satan Storm' by Gorgoroth is a prime example of music even somebody who isn't a black metal fan could listen to. And I've come to see about bm, it's an acquired taste and often people won't open their mind to it based on bad first impressions.
Barks? - Dogs bark. Woof.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.
Ah yes, Dimmu Borgir make anything other than melodic black metal seem detestable! Classical music as a backdrop can be very envisionary. Devin Townsend. Mm. Not only is the man a lyrical genius, he's a very beautiful singer. 'Avante garde' metal is technically classical! And Arcturus are the epitome of everything clean vocals should be. Their music is profound and meaningful even in todays materialistic society and so forth, lyrically speaking. And the fact that you can quite distinctly hear what they're saying is the quinessential factor in what defines their technique, it's as much about the words as it is the music.

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?
Dimmu do a lot of satanic-themed songs, which I think is a bit sad; but it's been their style for so long and it's all become a bit of a spoof. Take it with a pinch of salt I suppose. And all black metal's about satan, you've got to get used to it like! Devin, he's everything. Anything. Things that are meaningful, things that are ridiculous and everything in between. Arcturus are all about monism, things of nature, mankind, life and death in general.. they like their philosophy, our Arcturus.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?
I think the harmony part in 'Hide Nowhere' (at about 2mins 30secs into the song, and from then on) defines my favourite style of music.

Go into any detail you want and please go ahead and provide recommendations for listening or examples.Be candid or funny, I just want any comments you'd like to give at all.
I'm too busy trying to avoid watching some shit about whales fucking to get into that right now. I dunno why Leechy won't change the channel..

#143418 by WickedBuddhi
Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:05 am
Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.

I'm very picky with Growls. They must be understandable, no garbage garble.

I've yet to hear a bark!?

Screams are fine and Black Metal vocals are not my style unless they are used in Melodic Death Metal.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.

I love the Power Metal. Nothing like grown men belting out lyrics like women!

Usually my problem with some of the clean vocals or operatic styles come from the production side of things. Some sound just too clean. For example the band Threshold. Great Music, just way too clean of vocals, atleast on their new album.


What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?

Anything goes for themes.

I do prefer Philosophical and Social themes overall. Pain of Salvation, something to that extent.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?

My favorite styling is mixed. I'm really getting into this mixture of Death vocals with Clean. For example the new Scarve, Strapping Young Lad. If I had to choose a favorite even though the band is not technically metal, the style of Neil Fallon's in Clutch.
#143437 by Leechmaster
Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:15 pm
I'm not a connoisseur when it comes to these kinda things, and it really all depends on the individual being judged, but here goes anyway...

Explain your like or dislike of distorted vocals (growls, screams, grunts, black metal vox, and barks) in metal.
Growling can work well if the vocalist's really comfortable in doing it. If they just kinda grab some random guy or one of the musicians who isn't a vocalist already and get him to roar down the mic it just ain't gonna work well.
Not a massive fan of the Black Metal vocals. There's only a few bands I'll listen to in the genre. I get really lost as to what the vocalists are saying with almost every black metal band, and that really throws me off.
Screamo/Emo... Just.. Ow. They just hurt my ears. To whiny and high-pitched. Like nails on a chalkboard.
Grunting and barking should be left to the animals.

Explain your like or dislike of operatic and clean vocals (prominent in power metal, Devy's music, classic metal and thrash) in metal.
Clean vocals over metal can have ups and downs. The top people in metal who I think can really pull off the clean vox and have them fit well with the music are Dev, Simen Hestnæs (Better known as [ICS] Vortex) and Kristoffer Rygg (Better known as Garm). The three of them manage to put their clean vocals over pretty heavy music and have it meld perfectly without sounding horrendously cheesy. The same can not be said, however, for power/operatic metal vocalists. It's all just too much for me, really. I can't take the cheese. I can't stand people who sing like their testicles have just been lopped off by an axe.

What lyrical themes are appropriate for each?
Anything, really. Just because you play a certain style doesn't mean you should have to abide by laws of what you can write about. I couldn't care less if some really Satanic BM band wrote songs about lovely fuzzy kittens in wicker baskets and beautiful pink clouds shaped like cocker spaniels because it strays from BM's lyrical stereotypes. Each to their own.

Do you have a favorite vocal style? Why?
I can't really pick one out. It's all just down to the individual and the music behind him/her.

OOOO Sorry and if you wouldn't mind posting what region in the world you are from, that would rock!!
I hail from the isle of forty shades of green. (That'll be Ireland..)

#143447 by Goat
Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:40 pm
What about the dry academics? What schools of thought are you following? What will your thesis be?

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